How stupid is this going to get?

[Paul C7 to C8]

This has been said before but it may be worth saying again. Its all about choices....... whether it be religion, fashion. food, cars, travel, books, cell phones and so on, we generally choose what suits our tastes. And to be vaxxed or not vaxxed is just one more choice. As such, perhaps, if the individuals who are choosing to not get vaxxed placed as much time and effort in researching the vaccine benefits as they did in choosing their cell phone provider there may not be such a divide on the topic. Thankfully, the vast majority of people do know that the earth is round and that vaccines are not a new novelty and certainly have helped, and continue to help more people than they may have harmed. I am not very happy in saying this, but, over the past while, a lot of prominent anti vaxxers have passed away and I cant say I feel sorry for them. Their families yes, but not them. They stuck to their beliefs and paid the biggest price one can. You would think that their deaths would be a wake up call to the anti vax movement but obviously not. I say no jab and you get ill, end of the line you go..... again its about choices and choices have consequences. Selfishness should not be a criteria for taking a hospital bed away from someone else who may have taken the jab strictly for the betterment of those around him or her..... I do believe in freedom of choice, but, when the world is in the middle of a serious pandemic, common sense should prevail. Conspiracy theories? Its all fake? Mind control? Really? I'll say it again, the earth is round....

 

[Sonnythebull]

666 cases in Ontario Today , 300 in vaccinated and 300 in unvaccinated. 25 with one dose The rest have unknown vaccine status. vaccine efficacy is waning fast and the vaccinated are spreading it as much or more than any one due to lesser symptoms when they catch the virus.
Your vaccine status isn’t a badge of honour and it looks like you will be running for boosters for the rest of your life
The comments above from the vaccine maniacs would be acceptable if they were also directed at fattys , drunks , smokers and drug addicts.
its a joke that people run to science to save them and say “ listen to the doctors and science” but when the science and doctors tell your unhealthy fat ass to get in shape , drink less, stop smoking ,you ignore it cause “ it’s too hard “ .
welcome to the world of 0 personal responsibility where everyone else is supposed to save you while you do nothing to save yourself but get a needle .
Stop being a scared little human….,almost 37 million people in Canada alone haven’t even caught the virus since this all started .

 

[KLinNBC]

666 cases in Ontario Today , 300 in vaccinated and 300 in unvaccinated. 25 with one dose The rest have unknown vaccine status. vaccine efficacy is waning fast and the vaccinated are spreading it as much or more than any one due to lesser symptoms when they catch the virus.
.....

As stated before, by many experts, almost everyone is going to be infected by the Covid-19 virus and it's variants as time goes on. We were trying to control spread in the beginning, it was always understood that the spread was never going to be eliminated. In an effort to get back to "normal" the spread has indeed ramped up. As expected. The point is that those who are fully vaccinated are orders of magnitude less likely to end up in ICU. From the most recent data in Ontario (a day before your number because they don't update THIS number on Sundays and Mondays) of all the people in ICU only 13 are unvaccinated. Further although "breakthrough" cases are rising in the fully vaccinated only slightly more than half of NEW hospitalizations are from a population that comprises over 85% of the total. This should tell you something but given your belligerent, condescending know-it-all tone I expect it won't because, well, you already know it all...

 

[Paul C7 to C8]

Stop being a scared little human….,almost 37 million people in Canada alone haven’t even caught the virus since this all started .

Well its very obvious that your beliefs are strong as they should be, as we are all individuals. Having said that, I for one am not a "scared little human" as I'm sure the vast majority of vaccinated folks are not. Just choosing to play it safe. I wonder if those with your beliefs have ever turned down any type of medicine if you were to have ever been in need.... I bet not. But then I would guess that you would not ever admit to have been a scared little human.... BTW nice C8

 

[Sonnythebull]

As stated before, by many experts, almost everyone is going to be infected by the Covid-19 virus and it's variants as time goes on. We were trying to control spread in the beginning, it was always understood that the spread was never going to be eliminated. In an effort to get back to "normal" the spread has indeed ramped up. As expected. The point is that those who are fully vaccinated are orders of magnitude less likely to end up in ICU. From the most recent data in Ontario (a day before your number because they don't update THIS number on Sundays and Mondays) of all the people in ICU only 13 are unvaccinated. Further although "breakthrough" cases are rising in the fully vaccinated only slightly more than half of NEW hospitalizations are from a population that comprises over 85% of the total. This should tell you something but given your belligerent, condescending know-it-all tone I expect it won't because, well, you already know it all...

By your own logic you sound like a know it all too. as you seem to like numbers I will say it again 37 million people approximately in Canada alone haven’t even caught this virus. The people who are vulnerable to it should be protected everyone else should be allowed to live their life. But the vaccine maniacs, mask maniacs won’t let anyone. When you see people driving alone in cars with masks on and riding bicycles with a mask on but no helmet you know the fear is out of control and the stupidity is even more out of control

 

[Sonnythebull]

Well its very obvious that your beliefs are strong as they should be, as we are all individuals. Having said that, I for one am not a "scared little human" as I'm sure the vast majority of vaccinated folks are not. Just choosing to play it safe. I wonder if those with your beliefs have ever turned down any type of medicine if you were to have ever been in need.... I bet not. But then I would guess that you would not ever admit to have been a scared little human.... BTW nice C8

I wouldn’t turn down medicine I was in need of. This is not medicine you are in need of. Medicine you are in need of treats a condition or a disease… This is a therapeutic that hopefully will lower your own chance of a bad outcome. However that bad outcome is still non existent for 99 percent plus of people .

 

[Paul C7 to C8]

I wouldn’t turn down medicine I was in need of. This is not medicine you are in need of. Medicine you are in need of treats a condition or a disease… This is a therapeutic that hopefully will lower your own chance of a bad outcome. However that bad outcome is still non existent for 99 percent plus of people .

Well Sonnythebull, I respect your personal choice and would never try to talk someone out of what they truly believe in. In my current health condition it was never a question as to whether to get it or not, and Im sure I would have made the same choice regardless. Obviously, this Covid crap has caused a lot of emotions and divisions all over the world and it would appear that it will carry on for some time to come. We need to come up with another hot potato topic cause this one has prob run its course.... you either want/need the jab or you choose not to..... oh yah, maybe the hot potato topic could be lack of hospital beds for everyone... yes I can be a s**t disturber at times..... May you all stay healthy CCF members, regardless of your personal choice!!

 

[Sonnythebull]

Well Sonnythebull, I respect your personal choice and would never try to talk someone out of what they truly believe in. In my current health condition it was never a question as to whether to get it or not, and Im sure I would have made the same choice regardless. Obviously, this Covid crap has caused a lot of emotions and divisions all over the world and it would appear that it will carry on for some time to come. We need to come up with another hot potato topic cause this one has prob run its course.... you either want/need the jab or you choose not to..... oh yah, maybe the hot potato topic could be lack of hospital beds for everyone... yes I can be a s**t disturber at times..... May you all stay healthy CCF members, regardless of your personal choice!!

Would’ve been nice if they spent the last two years encouraging people to get in better shape and also to build more hospital capacity. Hospital capacity is key as we were lacking it before this happened. the problem I have is with with the insane reaction of the public. this type of stuff is insane and the fact the majority of the public is silent or on board with it is a major problem..

 

[KLinNBC]

By your own logic you sound like a know it all too. as you seem to like numbers I will say it again 37 million people approximately in Canada alone haven’t even caught this virus. The people who are vulnerable to it should be protected everyone else should be allowed to live their life. But the vaccine maniacs, mask maniacs won’t let anyone. When you see people driving alone in cars with masks on and riding bicycles with a mask on but no helmet you know the fear is out of control and the stupidity is even more out of control

I just provided facts, you seem to think everything you disagree with is stupid. Further, it's pretty obvious you don't have the faintest clue about the mental health issues that go hand-in-hand with a large proportion of obesity and substance abuse/addiction issues. You're clearly an arrogant bully. But enough of that. Tell us how, in clear and dispassionate steps, how you would solve the current problem of overflowing ICU's and cancelled/delayed surgeries nationwide. Just provide a real world, workable solution to that problem.

 

[Sonnythebull]

I just provided facts, you seem to think everything you disagree with is stupid. Further, it's pretty obvious you don't have the faintest clue about the mental health issues that go hand-in-hand with a large proportion of obesity and substance abuse/addiction issues. You're clearly an arrogant bully. But enough of that. Tell us how, in clear and dispassionate steps, how you would solve the current problem of overflowing ICU's and cancelled/delayed surgeries nationwide. Just provide a real world, workable solution to that problem.

‘I already did. They should have spent the last 2 years building out more hospital capacity , protecting the vulnerable , telling people to lose weight and get in shape all while allowing others to get on with life …. Bully? Oh boy what’s next I’m racist and a trans phobe?
speaking of mental health ….how’s the mental health of everyone from the lockdown and restrictions? That killed more than the virus

 

[KLinNBC]

‘I already did. They should have spent the last 2 years building out more hospital capacity , protecting the vulnerable , telling people to lose weight and get in shape all while allowing others to get on with life …. Bully? Oh boy what’s next I’m racist and a trans phobe?
speaking of mental health ….how’s the mental health of everyone from the lockdown and restrictions? That killed more than the virus

You did not. Hindsight is easy and actually pretty useless. How do you fix the problems now?

 

[Sonnythebull]

You did not. Hindsight is easy and actually pretty useless. How do you fix the problems now?

Accept that this virus will be here forever , in the history of mankind ( or to you maybe people kind) we have eliminated only one virus from the planet , small pox. This will not be eliminated.
so build out hospital capacity , force people to get in shape as much as they can ( if you are ok with forced vaccines you should be ok with forced exercise and diet) protect the vulnerable , accept people die and get on with life .
‘very simple..what’s your solution ? Lockdowns and boosters forever ?

 

[Black 03 Z06]

All, make your points without personal attacks. This will not be tolerated so please read and re read your posts prior to posting.

 

[KLinNBC]

Accept that this virus will be here forever , in the history of mankind ( or to you maybe people kind) we have eliminated only one virus from the planet , small pox. This will not be eliminated.
so build out hospital capacity , force people to get in shape as much as they can ( if you are ok with forced vaccines you should be ok with forced exercise and diet) protect the vulnerable , accept people die and get on with life .
‘very simple..what’s your solution ? Lockdowns and boosters forever ?

You still haven't provided a real solution to the problems we have and face for the immediate future. You proposals (if they were realistic) would only have effect maybe 5 years down the road.

The solution we are working with at this point (vaccination) will solve the ICU/surgery problem in as little as months if we can get better than 95% of the population fully vaccinated. This is because of the PROVEN facts that the vaccines reduce the magnitude of infection and there fore the need for hospitalization by a factor of 11 times or more. We may need booster shots in the face of breakouts and variants for a long time, or maybe not. Once the well of infection has been reduced to a certain point herd immunity will take over in that there will be very few deep infections. The reality at this point is there is no other option. This is all basic virology and population biology. Something I suspect you know very little about.

For the record, I am fed up with the masks and particularly resent that I have to wear one because at this point the only reason a vaccinated person wears a mask is to PROTECT THE UNVACCINATED. And the resultant aim of that is to keep them from clogging up hospitals. Mr. Sonneythebull has a not-so-well hidden agenda: he's probably in pretty good shape and likely younger. Younger than most on this forum no doubt. He thinks that all who are not really fit are lazy, stupid and irresponsible. And that all "fattys", drunks and drug addicts are weak at best and second class at least. There is little to be gained by even trying to discuss the finer points of mental health with someone so arrogant and callous.

I have another sort-of solution and that is to deny any hospitalization required as a result of covid infection to all unvaccinated people. This would at least solve the overflowing and collapsing medical system problem. Mr. StB and others would probably expand this ban to include "fattys" and "drug addicts" regardless of vaccination status. My answer to that is that the latter group is much more fun to hang with.

 

[LE BARON]

Accept that this virus will be here forever , in the history of mankind ( or to you maybe people kind) we have eliminated only one virus from the planet , small pox. This will not be eliminated.
so build out hospital capacity , force people to get in shape as much as they can ( if you are ok with forced vaccines you should be ok with forced exercise and diet) protect the vulnerable , accept people die and get on with life .
‘very simple..what’s your solution ? Lockdowns and boosters forever ?

Hmmm! Just how did they eliminate smallpox?
I don't believe we will see the elimination of CV-19 simply because it is mutating so fast.
So what choices do we have? Stay unvaccinated and run the almost certain risk of being infected and possible more serious complications? Or get vaccinated and quite possibly still catch it but with attenuated symptoms. Your choice.
Coming back from Hawaii in early March 2020 heard that they had a first case in the US. Seattle I believe. They were going to try and contain it. I said TOO LATE, its out now.
Then later I heard about some big cats being infected at one of the US zoos. So I says - here come the mutations and yearly vaccinations.
The idea that being healthy will eliminate sickness is a non-starter. That is not to say go out and drink and eat like a pig will not cause you harm. It is just that "healthiness" is not a free get out of jail card.
As our bodies age, even "healthy" people age, we will incur weakening of our immune systems and become more susceptible to all kinds of ailments both through our own genetic mutations and exterior challenges to our bodies.
Up to you to choose which side of the scale you want to be on

 

[KLinNBC]

All, make your points without personal attacks. This will not be tolerated so please read and re read your posts prior to posting.

Interesting comment from a moderator seeing as you approved/gave a thumbs up to a post that was inflammatory by any measure and used the term stupidity. Your bias is showing...

 

[Black 03 Z06]

Can you make any post without turning it in to a personal attack? Enough, one more and you are gone.

 

[LE BARON]

Well listening to the QC news we have over 700 new cases as of Friday.
Was interesting to hear the premier talking about it. When asked how worried about the higher case loads he said they are looking closely at the hospitalization rate and ICU rate both of which are declining.
So while there are breakthrough cases they are not leading to higher utilization of the hospitals so while the new figures are disconcerting there is not too much strain on the hospital system at this time.
STB can read my post 8254 with the comments from BC on who is going in to the hospitals.

 

[LE BARON]

Can you make any post without turning it in to a personal attack? Enough, one more and you are gone.

That would be too bad but we are here to discuss and not argue.
KL has the knowledge and experience to provide good commentary.
Need to keep it civil though or we get in to mud slinging.
I can see his frustration in that no presentation of proven facts and scientific evidence will sway some. In which case one must hope that Darwin's principles will work out for the best.

 

[Black 03 Z06]

Le Baron this is the key statement you made. Think it is pretty simple but that is not what happens.

Need to keep it civil though or we get in to mud slinging.