One year restriction on selling

[Black 03 Z06]

I would like to know if the "lien" is even legal? I suspect that it is not. If it is legal what is the basis of the Lien? Telling you what you can and cannot do with something you have bought and paid for as well as creating legal complications?

Seriously who would deal with an organization like that?

 

[DenisC8]

It's funny how its only certain dealerships (Brian Cullen) doing it, not every dealership is putting liens on the cars. Def puts a sour taste in your mouth. Funny dealerships can put MARKET Adjustments on hard to get cars and thats ok, I wait my 18 months and they put a lien on my car. Anyhow cars gone and a new one ordered at another dealership who doesn't put liens on them and is totally up front. Not oh by the way we are putting a lien on the car when you go sign the paper work. There was never a talk about a lien put on the car when I put my deposit on it.

I bought from Cullens in spring of 2021 and there was no lien or "no resale agreement".

Anyhow cars gone and a new one ordered at another dealership who doesn't put liens on them and is totally up front

wait are you saying you already sold your 2023 C8 and ordered another one? because of a lien that was there to prevent you from doing that?

 

[Cariboocreek]

I would like to know if the "lien" is even legal? I suspect that it is not. If it is legal what is the basis of the Lien? Telling you what you can and cannot do with something you have bought and paid for as well as creating legal complications?

Seriously who would deal with an organization like that?

A lien is only valid while there is a collateral attachment registered to a vehicle or a thing. When you borrow money to purchase a vehicle, the lender places a lien against the vehicle as protection for their monies loaned and in anticipation of you honoring the loan contract. A mechanic's lien or personal property lien can only be placed when there is money owed on a completed service. Once the value of the lien has been cleared either through the completion of a legal contract or through a final payment of an amount owed, there can be no lien. The dealers will likely argue that they have an "interest" in the property, but my guess that without some monies being owed, their argument would be laughed out of the building.

The real issue to the lien, especially if you are not "flipping" the car, is that liens tend to get forgotten as they are not in your face everyday. So five years from now you go to sell your C8 and find out the the lien is still on the vehicle (remember only the lien holder can remove the lien, or the courts through a court order) and your sale goes upside down. The Carfax info for example would not tell the buyer the amount of the lien, only that the lien has been registered against your C8. Poof, your sale has just become very complicated.

Under no circumstance should you accept a purchase with this type of lien on the car. Understand that if you are financing the car, the bank will have a registered lien but those liens are pretty straightforward to clear.

Anyone concerned with their agreement should seek a legal opinion.

As a reference: Personal Property Liens – Register an interest

 

[AndrewJ]

If you have to deal with this insane B S in order to get a C8, sign up for free Credit Karma and check it periodically as it shows PPSA registrations in your name. Once the year ends you can wait a month and check it to make sure the !&@^**!) Dealership removed it.

 

[TCinthe6]

Porsche Canada has been doing this for years and I actually took them to court and won. But will I see another GT car again? Nope. GM will do the same to anyone who sells their C8 within the year regardless of mileage. I have a friend who sold his C8 after 4 months to a local guy here in Toronto who still has it and he's not been blacklisted...I believe its only when the car crosses the border.

Loads of manufacturers are putting $1 or $10 liens on cars and I question the legality on that. If you don't like it they will tell you to pound sand...unless you are a major player with their dealership.

GM subsidizes our C8s here so its only smart that they protect themselves.

I had the same experience when I bought my last Porsche. It was a 6-8 month wait for a factory order, and certainly wasn't a GT car! Sales guy said it was to prevent cars from being exported, but I had no intention of selling inside a year so signed and didn't think much of it.

I've been told that GM wants 1 year of ownership + 12K km on the odometer before you can flip it, otherwise they may blacklist future sales.

I understand the intent of doing this, but I think they have done a shitty job in preventing many dealers from price gouging with market adjustments, as well as letting the first run of cars into the hands of commercial flippers.

Regardless, I patiently wait for the call that it's my turn to submit an order.

 

[rockitman]

Yes it stated 1 year or 12,000 kms.
That's 3 years driving for me.

 

[Rruuff Day]

Would that include if you traded it back in at the dealership to buy another one? Like a Z06? I usually trade my vehicles in to avoid the hassle of selling private. Last time I sold private it was my 911 Porsche. The guy who bought it for his wife was a pain in the ass. Kept calling and emailing me about stupid stuff. Even asked me about a small squeak he heard later. I stop replying finally.

hmmmm.... When he called about the squeak you should have told him you forgot to explain that there's a squirrel that lives under the seat..

 

[Murray20c8]

Would that include if you traded it back in at the dealership to buy another one? Like a Z06? I usually trade my vehicles in to avoid the hassle of selling private. Last time I sold private it was my 911 Porsche. The guy who bought it for his wife was a pain in the ass. Kept calling and emailing me about stupid stuff. Even asked me about a small squeak he heard later. I stop replying finally.

I always sell my cars "As Is". Then they can leave me alone! lol

 

[Sledhead]

All I know is Cullen put a 1 dollar lien on the car, I traded it in at another GM dealership and my car has since sold so obviously there's no issue or they resolved it as they wouldn't be able to sell it. SOOOOOO frustrating, Let me sell my car to who ever I want and if GM wants to black list me so be it ( theres lots of car manufacturers ), Dealers should stay out of it and be black listed for charging Market Adjustment. No dealers want you to trade the car into them so they can resell it for huge profit!!! The new dealership doesn't put a lien on the car and has been totally up front and honest. What about the people that need to sell the car because, say they lost there job, can't afford it anymore because cost of living went up, life happens!!! Oh No sorry you can't sell the car because a dealership put a dollar lien on the car! Nice!!!!!!

 

[rockitman]

I can't believe that a dealer has the right to impose a 1 year, 12,000km restriction on sales when the next dealer upsells the vehicle.
I'm in California now and the top Corvette dealer has a "Convience Fee" of $25,000 usd on Stingrays and $40,000-50,000 on Z06 models.
THAT is legal and acceptable! I admire GM for letting the dealers "Name That Price"

 

[DougHGMC8]

All I know is Cullen put a 1 dollar lien on the car, I traded it in at another GM dealership and my car has since sold so obviously there's no issue or they resolved it as they wouldn't be able to sell it. SOOOOOO frustrating, Let me sell my car to who ever I want and if GM wants to black list me so be it ( theres lots of car manufacturers ),

They did that to me as well. Not that I was really concerned as I intend to keep the car but they were not upfront about it. It was late in the process and very underhanded like it was no big deal. In the end we worked out an agreement to clarify what the lien was for including my rights and their obligations in an addendum they signed.
On the other hand GM Canada was amazing to deal with and kept me from going back to Stuttgart. So glad the C8 is such an amazing car that the sour taste of the purchase process has been wiped away by the miles of smiles.

 

[Jeffer2013]

A lien is only valid while there is a collateral attachment registered to a vehicle or a thing. When you borrow money to purchase a vehicle, the lender places a lien against the vehicle as protection for their monies loaned and in anticipation of you honoring the loan contract. A mechanic's lien or personal property lien can only be placed when there is money owed on a completed service. Once the value of the lien has been cleared either through the completion of a legal contract or through a final payment of an amount owed, there can be no lien. The dealers will likely argue that they have an "interest" in the property, but my guess that without some monies being owed, their argument would be laughed out of the building.

The real issue to the lien, especially if you are not "flipping" the car, is that liens tend to get forgotten as they are not in your face everyday. So five years from now you go to sell your C8 and find out the the lien is still on the vehicle (remember only the lien holder can remove the lien, or the courts through a court order) and your sale goes upside down. The Carfax info for example would not tell the buyer the amount of the lien, only that the lien has been registered against your C8. Poof, your sale has just become very complicated.

Under no circumstance should you accept a purchase with this type of lien on the car. Understand that if you are financing the car, the bank will have a registered lien but those liens are pretty straightforward to clear.

As a reference: Personal Property Liens – Register an interest

just to update with my limited knowledge

when the lien is paid off bug the bank for them to physically remove the lien so that the title is clear

the bank will tell you all you need is a letter or provide a letter but if yiu lose it or the new bank,or buyer wants a newer letter it is hard to get

keep bugging them until they do it
they are obligated to discharge the caveat but most stall or play games rather than do their job

the fricking province should pass legislation under the provincial statute that the financial institution has 30 days under which to properly discharge the lien and provide proof of discharge to the owner, problem solved

 

[Black 03 Z06]

I simply would not purchase a vehicle of any description with an illegal lien attached. Frankly I would not even bother taking it up with the incompetences who run the dealership, I would be in touch with my Member of Provincial Parliament and their Justice Department. We give up our rights much too easily. Why is Cullen even discussed here? They are not a supporting vendor.

 

[DenisC8]

I simply would not purchase a vehicle of any description with an illegal lien attached. Frankly I would not even bother taking it up with the incompetences who run the dealership, I would be in touch with my Member of Provincial Parliament and their Justice Department. We give up our rights much too easily. Why is Cullen even discussed here? They are not a supporting vendor.

Cullens is discussed here because they are number 1 corvette dealer in Canada, many members here bought from them multiple times with great service and only 3 people so far reported $1 liens, 1 or 2 of those 3 people have flipped/traded their corvettes for a profit before 1 year was up so maybe Cullens had a hunch about the buyers?

if you look at my "who is on the list" threads for E-Ray and Z06 you will also see that most people choose Cullens instead of the other 2 from the "top 3"

as for simply refusing to purchase, I agree 100% with you decision, and would gladly move up on the list when you take your deposit back.

as for our legal rights, I have a right to agree to any contract and enough character not run to the Gov when I decide not hold up my end of that contract.

 

[Jeffer2013]

I simply would not purchase a vehicle of any description with an illegal lien attached. Frankly I would not even bother taking it up with the incompetences who run the dealership, I would be in touch with my Member of Provincial Parliament and their Justice Department. We give up our rights much too easily. Why is Cullen even discussed here? They are not a supporting vendor.

here in alberta I saw the pc political donation list and most dealerships have donated 5 grand to the penny to the pc party
that is why they are left alone but the banks also have a lot of political clout
my provincial mla does not want to touch this even though he has admitted it would be a good idea

 

[Black 03 Z06]

Alright we all can have our opinions. I have mine.

2 of the top 3 Corvette Dealers in Ontario support this forum. Your preferred dealer does not, this place from what I can see does not run on "best wishes". Just out of curiosity how do you know they are the Number 1 dealer? Is your decision based on geography more than alternative buying options?

Only three people complained and their character is being attacked because they A) had what is in all likelihood an illegal lien put on something they own B) had the nerve to tell others of their dealings. Are these not the same people asking $160,000 for a used base C8? Maybe I got it wrong.

I would be more than happy to give up my spot so you can move up.

Legal Rights. The problem with your take is you talk about the three people who discussed the lien on here and yet what is not known is whether all cars leaving the dealership have this lien that the owners are just unaware of. You are welcome to give up any all contractual rights, that is your prerogative.

 

[Cariboocreek]

Alright we all can have our opinions. I have mine.

2 of the top 3 Corvette Dealers in Ontario support this forum. Your preferred dealer does not, this place from what I can see does not run on "best wishes". Just out of curiosity how do you know they are the Number 1 dealer? Is your decision based on geography more than alternative buying options?

Only three people complained and their character is being attacked because they A) had what is in all likelihood an illegal lien put on something they own B) had the nerve to tell others of their dealings. Are these not the same people asking $160,000 for a used base C8? Maybe I got it wrong.

I would be more than happy to give up my spot so you can move up.

Legal Rights. The problem with your take is you talk about the three people who discussed the lien on here and yet what is not known is whether all cars leaving the dealership have this lien that the owners are just unaware of. You are welcome to give up any all contractual rights, that is your prerogative.

I agree except you cannot contractually agree to do something that is contradictory to any legislation or the Charter.

 

[DenisC8]

Alright we all can have our opinions. I have mine.

2 of the top 3 Corvette Dealers in Ontario support this forum. Your preferred dealer does not, this place from what I can see does not run on "best wishes". Just out of curiosity how do you know they are the Number 1 dealer? Is your decision based on geography more than alternative buying options?

Only three people complained and their character is being attacked because they A) had what is in all likelihood an illegal lien put on something they own B) had the nerve to tell others of their dealings. Are these not the same people asking $160,000 for a used base C8? Maybe I got it wrong.

I would be more than happy to give up my spot so you can move up.

Legal Rights. The problem with your take is you talk about the three people who discussed the lien on here and yet what is not known is whether all cars leaving the dealership have this lien that the owners are just unaware of. You are welcome to give up any all contractual rights, that is your prerogative.

I say Number 1 Corvette Dealer based only on allocation numbers from the information I have been following since June 2020 regarding monthly allocations.

Are you suggesting that we should be pushing paid sponsors who deliver less cars and not mention the dealership that delivers the most cars just because they don't pay this forum? hell then we can replace members with bots that will tell you which sponsors to get the car from, who to use for PPF/Ceramic, insurance, cleaning products and accessories. I have been on forums like that where every second thread was a sponsor's not so subtle advertisement, and admins would delete comments that did not toe the company line. That forum died, but funny thing is for months after with no human activity including from admins, the sponsor bots continued to post and comment on their own posts.

Personally, I cannot be bought or sold so when someone asks "where should I order my corvette?" I will always answer "pick any of the top 3 corvette dealers" and if they ask me which one of the top 3 I picked when I bought my C8" I will answer "Cullens, because from my knowledge they get the most C8 allocations"

I honestly believe if there is a lien, that the buyers are always notified before the order is submitted, same as what Porsche does.

 

[DenisC8]

I agree except you cannot contractually agree to do something that is contradictory to any legislation or the Charter.

so if you know that its illegal to agree to the contract then you are also in violation of the charter by signing and taking the car?

 

[Cariboocreek]

so if you know that its illegal to agree to the contract then you are also in violation of the charter by signing and taking the car?

No. If there is a conflict between you and the other party then the contract becomes null and void or the conditions become unenforceable. Nobody cares until somebody cares.

Any one concerned should seek a legal opinion as to their agreement.