It’s inevitable

Godabitibi said:
I want to address a misunderstanding of MOST seasonnal vehicle owners about the battery.
You should NEVER remove the battery to bring it inside for winter time. And for your information I'm a retired full time mechanic teacher of 23 years after 15 years of mostly dealer mechanic.
A fully charged battery is better stay in the cold than in a heated house basement. Cold slow down the chemical reaction within the battery and prolong it's usable life.
We have a tendency to think cold is bad for a battery but it's not. USING IT in cold to start a cold motor is hard on it, but not sitting in cold. Just make sure you fully charge it and let her sit outside but disconnected. A not fully charged battery will become sulfated and that is a no return condition. And BTW a reading of 12 volt is a dead battery, she has to be at least 12.6 to be fully charged. Each cell is 2.1 volt x 6.
Sitting in the cold the battery is kind of in sleeping mode because the electrons have a hard time to move and that is why it does not crank well. Like someone just awakened, it has to awake slowly to perform properly. This is the reason they say to turn on the headlamps on before starting a cold engine to let the electrons move a bit to warm them up before trying to start an almost seized engine by that cold thick oil and parts friction.
So remember that HEAT AND HUMIDITY is the WORST ennemy of a battery. As a fact a battery that has a 5 years garranty in Canada is only 3 years in Florida in many case.

I hope this will help some of you to better understand a battery life which is considered 5 years by the factory.
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I agree with what you are saying. Incidentally I’m an electrician so have some knowledge of this topic. As for removing the battery and storing it inside to the best of my knowledge if it’s kept on a battery maintainer/trickle charger, then no harm no foul. As you said keeping a battery fully charged is always the best practice regardless of the situation. Some people not understanding the principles may put their vehicle into storage not realizing that it isn’t at full charge because of perhaps repeated short trips for example and then you can have issues for sure. Knowledgeable information is always welcome, so thanks for taking the time to post this.
 
Godabitibi said:
I agree with you on that. But many owners just bring it in and never look at it. With this method it's better to leave her out in the cold. The sulfation process will be slower.
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True. Then again it’s harder to steal a vehicle that has no battery in it…. :rolleyes:
 
1st Vette said:
I agree with what you are saying. Incidentally I’m an electrician so have some knowledge of this topic. As for removing the battery and storing it inside to the best of my knowledge if it’s kept on a battery maintainer/trickle charger, then no harm no foul.
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A trickle charger usually has voltage higher than the battery. If it's output is 13 volts then there is always potential (voltage). If there is always potential then there is always something it's trying to do. If there is no drain on a battery then it makes no sense to use a trickle charger or any charger for that matter. Yes, there is always some internal resistance between the poles so there is always a minimal drain on the battery, but over the course of 6 months I doubt there is any issue at all.
(For Jack. I'm a retired computer geek so I know what I'm talking about .... sometimes) ;)

P.S. I majored in electronics in College and minored in women, but it was 40 years ago I worked in that field so whatDoEyeNo.
 
Murray20c8 said:
A trickle charger usually has voltage higher than the battery. If it's output is 13 volts then there is always potential (voltage). If there is always potential then there is always something it's trying to do. If there is no drain on a battery then it makes no sense to use a trickle charger or any charger for that matter. Yes, there is always some internal resistance between the poles so there is always a minimal drain on the battery, but over the course of 6 months I doubt there is any issue at all.
(For Jack. I'm a retired computer geek so I know what I'm talking about .... sometimes) ;)

P.S. I majored in electronics in College and minored in women, but it was 40 years ago I worked in that field so whatDoEyeNo.
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They will discharge on average about 3% per month at 20c so the longer it sits the greater the benefit of a battery maintainer. Most have a voltage regulator internal. They will apply voltage as required to maintain a fully charged state. But no doubt the best storage conditions for a battery if it’s fully charged is at the lowest temperature available. I always try to stay in a higher grade of accommodation than a “ Holiday Inn Express “ . :rolleyes:
 
Regarding the oil change part, most (all?) boat manufacturers include changing the oil before storage as a basic item to do. I believe the basic thought is to not let the engine sit in oil that contans contaminants from the combustion process - these including acids etc....I have always done this with my boat engines and also on my MB convertible that I don't use in the winter. My thinking is it certainly can't hurt and if you're going to change the oil anyway why not get it out of the engine before it sits for 5-6 months? Certainly Volvo Penta and Mercruiser (both mainly using basic car engine blocks from GM) want you to change the oil before storage....
 
pnevillebc said:
Regarding the oil change part, most (all?) boat manufacturers include changing the oil before storage as a basic item to do. I believe the basic thought is to not let the engine sit in oil that contans contaminants from the combustion process - these including acids etc....I have always done this with my boat engines and also on my MB convertible that I don't use in the winter. My thinking is it certainly can't hurt and if you're going to change the oil anyway why not get it out of the engine before it sits for 5-6 months? Certainly Volvo Penta and Mercruiser (both mainly using basic car engine blocks from GM) want you to change the oil before storage....
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Mercruiser have built Corvette engines before. For the C4 ZR-1 .
www.topspeed.com

Chevrolet and Mercury Marine Remember the Merc-Powered Corvette ZR-1

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Best winter storage practices, and why, as a Mechanical Engineer, car guy, and former fuels quality assurance specialist for one of the major Canadian oil companies:
Fuel tank: try to run your tank down a bit, then fill it up, with a shot of fuel stabilizer - e.g. "Sta-bil". The fresh gas and stabilizer will minimize the chance of gum, sediment and varnish formation in the fuel. A full tank reduces the breathing space in the tank, which helps reduce condensation and fuel degradation.
Oil: If your not due for an oil change by km, it's your choice, spring or fall - and as has been mentioned, you can reset or ignore the oil life indicator - winter storage only counts if you change your oil once/year and you don't put enough miles on it to hit the the oil change interval by mileage.
Tires: Avoid flat-spotting by putting it up on blocks, or use tire savers. I want to move my car around during the winter without starting it, so I use wheel dollies, and I bought a bunch of interlocking foam panels, like you use in a home exercise room - I cut them up into pieces that form about a 2" thick, evenly curved layer between the tire and the dolly - that gives me lots of surface area - same idea as tire savers.
Rodent Management: I have the luxury of a heated, rodent-free attached garage, but God forbid, if I was storing my car outside, or in an unheated garage which could have mice, I would definitely put out some poison bait boxes in the garage, under the car and a couple inside the car.
Battery: Again, since I have a heated garage, I don't pull the battery, just leave a tender on it all winter. If I was leaving it in an unheated garage, I would pull the battery and put it on a tender - BUT DON'T PUT IT ON A CONCRETE FLOOR - that will wreck the battery - sorry I don't have the science on why that is. Ideal battery storage temperature is 15-20C. I know some of this is contrary to our local spelling champ Mr. Godabitibi, but I usually get 7+ years out of my batteries, and it gets a lot colder in Edmonton than Ottawa. (But he is right that you want to keep the battery fully charged, and batteries don't last as long in hot climates)
 
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Well I guess I made a BIG mistake saying I know what I'm talking about I now being named Mr Champ. 😮‍💨
First I didn't say a battery only live 5 years. I said it is considered a normal life, many batteries live far more than that.
And for the concrete story this not true since a LONG time. It's an old fact that was transfered from the time when battery cases where made out of wood. I asked myself a battery factory trainor. Over my 23 years of teachng mechanic I did read and search a lot on batteries and also had training from battery experts. Take it or not I consider myself to have some knowledge on them.
 
Sorry for making fun of your spelling. News to me, but you're right, modern batteries are OK to store on a concrete floor - old habits die hard, I guess. In our climate, I'm still not a fan of leaving batteries in cars over the winter at -30-40C - too many dead batteries and cars that won't start around here in our winter conditions.
 
1st Vette said:
They will discharge on average about 3% per month at 20c so the longer it sits the greater the benefit of a battery maintainer. Most have a voltage regulator internal. They will apply voltage as required to maintain a fully charged state. But no doubt the best storage conditions for a battery if it’s fully charged is at the lowest temperature available. I always try to stay in a higher grade of accommodation than a “ Holiday Inn Express “ . :rolleyes:
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That's what I said. It's negligible! lol
 
E-TownC8 said:
Sorry for making fun of your spelling. News to me, but you're right, modern batteries are OK to store on a concrete floor - old habits die hard, I guess. In our climate, I'm still not a fan of leaving batteries in cars over the winter at -30-40C - too many dead batteries and cars that won't start around here in our winter conditions.
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I lived most of my life far north of Quebec where we would see -40c. I totally understand what you're saying about hard cranking. Like I said this is a two way problem, a cold battery yes but more particularly a frozen engjne. An engine with very cold oil is super hard to crank and over that the battery chemistry is slowed down.
Everyone is free to do what they want to do with their battery. But myself I know as a fact that cold is NOT HARD on a battery when she is not working hard and it only slow down the aging effect.

Everybody is free to store their battery as they want I was only trying to help giving info.

BTW talking about oil if someone want to visualize cold oil in an engine try searching ESSO COLD WAR video on the net. It's been produced at Esso laboratory in Kapuskasing Ontario.

I just found it and copy paste it.
 
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