OIL. MOBIL1 or DEXOS1. ?

[nascar03]

Hi Gents...

All this recent talk about MOBIL1 oil vs GM DEXOS oil got me checking a few things.
I use MOBIL1 in my 2003 Monte Carlo SS 3.8L V6, as well as my 2003 Corvette LS1.
I still use CASTROL GTX in my 1975 Corvette ZZ4 crate motor. I may convert to synthetic someday, but I still have a bit of GTX left in the shed.
I've been buying MOBIL1 10W-30 for all the cars even though the cap(s) says 5W-30.
I do this thinking 10 is a bigger number than 5 so it MUST be better lubrication!

We recently bought a new 2017 Equinox and the cap says DEXOS 5W-30.
I just did the first oil change last week and put in MOBIL1 10W-30.
This may not be a good thing... not sure yet?

So I did some reading and also got out a couple of MOBIL1 oil jugs.

First is MOBIL1 5W-30, blue label.
This states on the front that it is DEXOS approved.
On the rear specs sheet it says :
"approved for GM DEXOS1. License [HASHTAG]#GB1A0915015[/HASHTAG].........
Recommended for use in applications requiring GM 6094M and GM 4718M"

Second is MOBIL1 10W-30, green label.
This DOES NOT state on the front that it is DEXOS approved.
On the rear spec sheet it says almost the same as above (5W-30):
"Recommended for use in applications requiring GM 6094M and GM 4718M"
But no mention of DEXOS?

They both seem to meet the same applications but only the 5W-30 is listed as DEXOS approved. Odd.
There was mention on an interweb site that the new DEXOS oil is less likely to aerate(make bubbles).
And goes on to say that that is very important with some of the newer motors that demand an oil with higher hydraulic properties"
What?


I love synthetic oil. Many years ago I converted our daily-driver 2010 Pontiac G5 to MOBIL1 and I swear the car ran better/smoother/quieter and it also improved the gas mileage by 1-2 mpg.

So..? What does anybody else think of 5W-30 vs 10W-30 MOBIL1...?
I come from the old days where we ran GTX 20W-50 as an engine got older.


Graham

 

[YFCvii]

Wow ... I recall my Dad and my Grandfather before him repeating the words ...
"I won't touch cars these days as there is nothing under the hood that is familiar any more" (lol)

OMG ... I thought I just got a handle on Mobil 1 being the recommended C7 dry sump equipped Synthetic by GM Canada today.
In celebration, I just proudly applied my peel & stick label that I found in my glove box delivery package (below) as instructed ...
and now I feel I'm gonna be soon continuing my Family Alpha Male Legacy with having to decipher specifics of Mobil 1 ...

(thank god the sticker appears to be specific enough for me) Cheers !

 

[smackYYZ]

With our cars being specified 5W30, I would stick with it since by using a 10W30 your giving up cold start protection and here in Canada that is more important then it is in the south. I'd also not use the AC Delco Syth, it's not the same as Mobil 1.

Here are 2 great resourses on automotive oils.

Bob is the Oil Guy

and

Motor Oil Engineering test data

Here you will see the oils rated for Wear Protection
#9 5W30 Mobil 1, Advanced Full Synthetic, API SN, GM dexos 1 approved = 117,799 psi
#11 10W30 Mobil 1, Advanced Full Synthetic, API SN = 115,635 psi
[HASHTAG]#124[/HASHTAG]. 5W30 GM’s AC Delco dexos 1 API SN semi-synthetic = 76,501 psi

The AC Delco is way down the list.

 

[nascar03]

Smack...
Thanx for the test data.
I wonder why MOBIL1 10W-30 isn't DEXOS approved?

SNIII.
Nice decal.
I want to find a few MOBIL1 decals to place near the filler cap.
Maybe I'll drop them an e-mail.
They are a Corvette Club sponsor.

Graham

 

[smackYYZ]

Smack...
Thanx for the test data.
I wonder why MOBIL1 10W-30 isn't DEXOS approved?

Graham

From what I understand, to meet the Dexos 1 Standard, can only be 0W or 5W and must contain molybdenum as the anti wear ingredient . So I would assume it fails on the cold viscosity being 10W so doesn't qualify. GM wants all new cars to use 0W or 5W, since it is easier on the engine at start and also gives better fuel economy.

 

[theboss]

Dexos is a specification created by GM. Dexos1 is for gas engines and Dexos 2 is for diesel engines. Every company who use the Dexos logo have to pay a royalty fee to GM. Most of the great name like Pennzoil, Castrol, Valvoline and others meet the requierement for Dexos but the companys dont want to pay for every single bottle they sale so the use the logo only on some lines of product. Many synthetic blend (not even full synthetic) have the logo and are aprove by GM. The grade of oil is important but not as much as the specifications, that been said, if your engine requires 5w30 dexos aprove and you only have 5w30 not aprove and 5w20 aprove, you should pick the 5w20 because it meet specifications. This is only for American cars, Europeen cars have way more different specification. In my shop at every oil change we do, the technician check for the right oil, its not an option, they have to, if a customer have an engine failure, I want to be sure I can provide proof that we use the right product

Beleive it or not, engine oil is the easy part, transmissions fluid, gear oil and power steering are kind of complicated

Stephane

 

[nascar03]

Thanx BOSS.

Graham

 

[YFCvii]

Smack...
Thanx for the test data.
I wonder why MOBIL1 10W-30 isn't DEXOS approved?

SNIII.
Nice decal.
I want to find a few MOBIL1 decals to place near the filler cap.
Maybe I'll drop them an e-mail.
They are a Corvette Club sponsor.

Graham

Hi Graham,
The sticker was on the back of a brochure booklet that came in my delivery package from Northgate Chevrolet in Edmonton.
I am not sure if this booklet found its way into my package by the GM Factory or by the Dealer. I can tell you it is Canadian with the English & French.
The booklet mentions Mobil.ca ... http://lubes.mobil.ca/canada-english-lcw/carengineoils_products_mobil-1.aspx
Contacting via the link might get the booklet with sticker from Mobil.
Otherwise maybe contacting a known Dealership that delivers a Corvette with the Mobil 1 booklet in their packages might be another avenue.
Best news I got today is that the use of Mobil 1 in various Corvette Models/features is documented in Dealerships by the VIN number.
I had 2 Dealerships today find that my VIN number correlates with the document for recommended use of only the Mobil 1 product (which might link to the dry sump specification).
Now that I have my sticker placed in the engine compartment, I have a lot more confidence with my insisting on the specific Mobil 1 product.
Best of Good Fortune to you!
Spence

 

[Dub]

Has anyone used Redline synthetic? That is all I used in my Mustangs and Mopars. I haven't switched the Vette over, simply because the original owner always used Mobil 1 so I have continued to do so.

 

[YFCvii]

Has anyone used Redline synthetic? That is all I used in my Mustangs and Mopars. I haven't switched the Vette over, simply because the original owner always used Mobil 1 so I have continued to do so.

When I finally found out just yesterday that GM Canada has put a document in the hands of Dealership Service Managers that states C7 Oil Recommendations by cross-referencing the specific VIN of the Corvette, I followed up with a question as to whether this would exist for previous generations of the Corvette (and where). This question could not be answered and maybe Mobil 1 Canada would be best to approach as to whether they have that answer (after all it would be in their best interest ... and yours too). Mobil as obviously worked close with GM on this. Sorry I don't have an instant answer but hope to have a direction that reaps you a reward and I have to say that not changing something that isn't broken from previous ownership is a good resolve until you know otherwise ...

 

[YFCvii]

Dexos is a specification created by GM. Dexos1 is for gas engines and Dexos 2 is for diesel engines. Every company who use the Dexos logo have to pay a royalty fee to GM. Most of the great name like Pennzoil, Castrol, Valvoline and others meet the requierement for Dexos but the companys dont want to pay for every single bottle they sale so the use the logo only on some lines of product. Many synthetic blend (not even full synthetic) have the logo and are aprove by GM. The grade of oil is important but not as much as the specifications, that been said, if your engine requires 5w30 dexos aprove and you only have 5w30 not aprove and 5w20 aprove, you should pick the 5w20 because it meet specifications. This is only for American cars, Europeen cars have way more different specification. In my shop at every oil change we do, the technician check for the right oil, its not an option, they have to, if a customer have an engine failure, I want to be sure I can provide proof that we use the right product

Beleive it or not, engine oil is the easy part, transmissions fluid, gear oil and power steering are kind of complicated

Stephane

Very helpful for a "put the key in and go" which is now a "push the button and go" C7 owner.
... and also re-live ...
Wow ... I recall my Dad and my Grandfather before him repeating the words ...

"I won't touch cars these days as there is nothing under the hood is familiar any more"

​

 

[Armitage]

Who starts a C7 during a freezing Canadian winter? Just kidding... sort of...

 

[Rruuff Day]

Who lets their C7 freeze during a Canadian winter..... That's what the wife's SUV is for...

 

[smackYYZ]

Has anyone used Redline synthetic? That is all I used in my Mustangs and Mopars. I haven't switched the Vette over, simply because the original owner always used Mobil 1 so I have continued to do so.

Dub,

If you look at the test link I posted you'll see the reason why you shouldn't use Redline. I don't think I'd use it in mine.

Mike

Redline 30wt Race Oil synthetic (lab tested 2011)
Silicon = 23 ppm (anti-foaming agent in new oil, but in used oil, certain gasket materials and dirt can also add to this number)
Boron = 70 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge, anti-wear)
Magnesium = 4 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Calcium = 1982 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Barium = 3 ppm (detergent/dispersant, anti-deposit buildup/anti-sludge)
Zinc = 2207 ppm (anti-wear)
Phos = 2052 ppm (anti-wear)
Moly = 1235 ppm (anti-wear)
Potassium = 4 ppm (anti-freeze corrosion inhibitor)
Sodium = 20 ppm (anti-freeze corrosion inhibitor)
TBN = 5.0 (Total Base Number is an acid neutralizer to prevent corrosion. Most gasoline engine motor oils start with TBN around 8 or 9)
Viscosity (cSt at 100*C) = 9.9 (cSt range for SAE 30 is 9.3 to 12.4) And cSt (centistokes) in general terms, represents an oil’s thickness.

.
These ZDDP values are high enough here, that this oil really is only suited for short life dedicated racing engines, as the name implies. Using zinc/phos levels this high in other engines could be cause for concern, since excessively high levels, can “cause” engine damage rather than “prevent” it.

.
The very low TBN value in this Redline oil is also consistent with short term use only.

 

[Jeremiad]

I don't even know if I want to post a reply to this thread for the heartache that it may recount, but experience and hard-earned knowledge is better than blatant ignorance. It pains me to even think about some of the foolish decisions that are made over engine oil, but please let me assure you, the wrong choice is a costly mistake.

The question of what oil to use in your car is a very important subject. A lot of people might like to argue it, and it has even been touched a bit in this thread even. I don't want to start any bullshit arguments in this thread, but the one thing that I will argue is that your choice of oil is imperative to your engine's survival. It is literally the blood of your engine's heart. When it fails.... damage happens fast. Do some research, and make your choices wisely.

The links posted above have some good information if you have the patience and interest to read them. If you only ever drive your car on tours and cruises on nice days in the summer, then you will probably be just fine with the recommended Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic. I've never tried Dexos and will not. There is plenty of info out there to show that it does not stand up to the same levels as the Mobil 1.

The purpose of this thread was to ask between these two oils, so this is just another opinion to consider, but please do pay attention to the other information here. The links above, and your own research, as well as other peoples' experiences.

With that in mind, I have also experienced catastrophic failure due to oiling issues while using Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic, so don't think that it is a miracle fluid either. Knowing what oil to use and when can be a complicated issue. There are also at least a couple of other oils that I am aware of that are formulated specifically for LSx engines, such as Brad Penn and Joe Gibbs, both of which are endorsed by GM although I don't know if they are supported by warranty specifications, and I highly doubt that a GM dealer will even stock them let alone use them without additional cost.

 

[Dub]

Wow Thanks for the helpful info, regarding Redline. At one time I was convinced by someone that Redline was the chit, but obviously it isn't.

 

[Armitage]

I just had my 800 break-in oil change... I took it to Leggat Chevrolet in Burlington Ontario. My 2017 has Mobil 1 on the oil cap, as well as it came with a sticker for me to install (why the factory don't do it is beyond me, they install all the other stickers). I asked if they used Mobil 1 on Vettes and he said they do, and it was on my receipt stating Mobil 1. I didn't not get any "remainder" from a bottle though. leggatchevrolet.ca

 

[Creedence85]

Old thread but wanted to chime in since I'm interested in oil specs. If you've been using Mobil 1 10w30 in your C5 for over 34,000 hours, it's hard to argue with those results.

With modern engines you're well advised to follow the manufacturer's oil spec on the weight since that's the oil spec the engine designers used when designing the oil passageways. Modern engines are built to tighter tolerances in the ever continuing pursuit of fuel economy and emissions, so the allowable variance diminishes as tolerances tighten. As long as the oil meets the particular API spec for your engine such as API SN it should be fine. After that, a manufacturer specific spec such as GM Dexos1 et. al. in most applications is less critical, though may be a requirement in retaining engine warranty, so it would be good to investigate if a non Dexos1 oil such as the Mobil 1 10w30 voids the warranty.

With synthetics, the most important thing to look for is whether it's a group 3 or group 4, as group 3 is formulated from conventional base stock which is hydrotreated, and group 4 from synthetic base stock which is derived from polyalphaolefin. As good as hydrotreating is, a synthetic derived oil is more uniform in its molecular structure, and most of the major conventional oils are all hydrotreated now, which begs the question, what is the difference between a hydrotreated conventional oil, which the API also calls a group 3, and a group 3 synthetic? I suspect the difference between group 3 conventional and group 3 synthetics are marketing, as the only real difference would be the additives, so if you want a group 3 you can probably use a conventional and save money, and if you want a true synthetic, it's worth it to use a group 4.